Maya Gwynn
With KVCR Public Media, I'm Maya Gwynn with Black Perspectives IE, a show we learn about the amazing things members of the Black community are doing in the Inland Empire. My guest today is Hakan Jackson, Co-Founder of The People's Collective for Environmental Justice. So nice to meet you. I'm happy you're here.
Hakan Jackson
Happy to be here.
Maya Gwynn
This is a topic I've been wanting to talk about for a long time. To start off, the Inland Empire consistently ranks among the worst regions in California for air pollution, which is something I wasn't aware of until I started researching. What are the main sources driving poor air quality here?
Hakan Jackson
It's logistics, right, whether it be from the LA and Long Beach harbors, and because we have the mountains and stuff over here, all that pollution. And your worst standard for fuel is used in a lot of those ships. The rail yards, that's another huge source. And then I'm sure, as you've seen, a lot of the warehouses and in a lot of this is because of how much of the goods for this country comes in through that LA and Long Beach Harbor, because, yeah, the Panama Canal was built around when, like, the Queen Mary was the big ship in the sea, and so most ships, they can't fit through there. And so I don't have a statistic right off the top my head, but it's like two thirds of the country's goods - because of so much stuff that comes from Asia, because that's main source of outsourcing - all that logistics, the ships, the trucks, a lot of those trucks, they just idle while they're loading and unloading, and you can see each one of those trucks on the road is about 200 cars worth of pollution. So yeah, that's why our air is so bad.
Maya Gwynn
Yeah. What are some policies or systems at the local, state and federal levels that have failed to protect the Inland Empire communities from environmental hazards? And how does your organization hold corporations and government agencies accountable for resulting in health and pollution impacts?
Hakan Jackson
Yeah. I mean, I can talk forever about this subject. Literally, logistics was the whole reason why Columbus left Spain to find a better source for spice. But, I mean, we do have, like, a lot of protections here in California, but, you know, at the end of the day, dollars are all that people care about, right? It's money that gets politicians elected, and so one of the big things that we fight with is the story of jobs versus health. That's why, like a lot of times when we have CEQA to kind of gage how much pollution a new building is going to bring into the area, it gets completely bypassed, because politicians can say, well, this is going to bring jobs. But a lot of cities have had warehouse moratoriums, I believe, Perris, Jurupa Valley, and some of it is just sick of being stuck in traffic and being surrounded by trucks. Some of it just is the blight of warehouses, right? They don't really add much to our communities. There's not really adding services or anything for our children or anybody to utilize, and there are not the best jobs as well. We hear all kinds of horror stories about what it is to labor inside of warehouses.
Maya Gwynn
Which affects your health even more.
Hakan Jackson
Yeah. And to get back to your question, we have AQMD or South Coast AQMD, which is like a more local entity that regulates the air quality in our area, but we're still limited, because, speaking of rail yard, that has to be regulated federally, right? So I think that the biggest thing that we do is just community building, right? Like, part of the reason why our neighborhoods are targeted is because politicians feel like they can get away with it. A lot of it is like in unincorporated areas. Or areas where people are renters, or moving around a lot, and people who are just used to government not caring. So a lot of it is community building and bringing awareness and making sure people know the true costs that come with you know those terrible warehouse jobs or anything else that they promise. I think the latest thing that they're pushing are the data centers, which I don't think we've gotten too much here in the IE but, but that's been environmental justice issue a lot in the South.
Maya Gwynn
Can you explain about that?
Hakan Jackson
Yeah, data warehouses, as we all see, like with the growth of AI, one of the things that's holding AI back is processing power. And to build up processing power, you need a lot of equipment, processors and stuff like that, and data centers, which one: causes huge increase of power, which have caused a lot of power bills go up. But also these systems need to be cooled. So they've been using a lot of water to cool it down. Then on top of that, the increased power, a lot of time, is just being generated using diesel. So that's like three ways, just off the bat.
Maya Gwynn
Yeah, I'm really happy you said that. I saw on, I think, Instagram, how much water AI uses when you ask a question to Chat GPT. I was like, okay, yeah, I'll never use that again. It was very shocking. I graduated high school in 2009 and I was also at a very conservative, PWI high school, so caring about the environment was seen as kind of nerdy. But I do feel like that has definitely shifted. Definitely Gen Z and some Millennials are very interested in the environment. When you guys talk to people and community build, are people really receptive, or is there still a hesitancy, especially because I feel like the Inland Empire is also is very conservative.
Hakan Jackson
There's been like so much propaganda. I mean, a lot of people don't know that recycle, reduce, reuse messaging came from the oil industry, so that you thought of it as a personal issue rather than a oil industry issue, so people are self-policing and not looking at the corporations. There's just been a disconnect. And then, or just whenever I think about environmental issues, we see polar bears or pandas and stuff like that. We don't think about what's in our backyard. We need a good environment to live in as well, not just animals. I mean, don't get me wrong, I love nature, but we got to take care of ourselves, too.
Maya Gwynn
And do you feel like when you say that messaging to people, do you feel like people are receptive?
Hakan Jackson
Yeah. I mean, I think when you start talking about illnesses that aren't normal in other areas, right? Like, you know, people know somebody who's had to deal with cancer or asthma. We have more stuff out there that keeps track - your weather services will tell you what the air quality is. I mean, I think that's another thing with the older generation, is pollution used to be more visible, right? And they see that like, oh, the air is much clearer than what we grew up with, but a lot of it you can't see. You just got to break down the actual impacts. And people start thinking like, Oh, this is affecting me. This is affecting my children or my grandchildren.
Maya Gwynn
So it's all about communication, for sure. We're gonna move to a rapid-fire portion. So I'm excited to see your answers. If your work had a theme song, what would it be?
Hakan Jackson
Maybe American Terrorists by Lupe Fiasco.
Maya Gwynn
Okay, coming out strong. If you had to teach a master class or give a TED Talk on a random skill you have besides the work you already do, what would it be?
Hakan Jackson
It would probably be emotional intelligence.
Maya Gwynn
Okay, that's a good one. And do you have a favorite IE restaurant or landmark that reminds you of the Inland Empire?
Hakan Jackson
The Columbian mammoth on the 60 is probably my landmark, because that's Jurupa Valley.
Maya Gwynn
Yeah, definitely. And how can people keep up with you and support the important work you guys are doing?
Maya Gwynn
Awesome. Thank you so much for being here. This is such an important conversation.
Hakan Jackson
Our website, the PCEJ: People's Collective Environmental Justice. So the pcej.org. And then also look up PCEJ on Instagram, on Tiktok, we're on Facebook.
Hakan Jackson
Thank you. Thank you for having me.
Maya Gwynn
Of course. Hakan Jackson is Co-Founder of The People's Collective for Environmental Justice. Find this segment and others at kvcrnews.org/bpie. Support for this segment comes from the M.E.C.C.A. IE Fund at the Inland Empire Community Foundation, advancing racial equity and supporting long term investments and black led organizations in Riverside and San Bernardino counties. Join us again next week for Black Perspectives IE. For KVCR Public Media, I'm Maya Gwynn, thank you.
